Maniphest T56487

Proposal: Invert Greasy Pencil's layer stacking order
Closed, ArchivedDESIGN
Actions

Assigned To
Antonio Vazquez (antoniov)
Authored By
TheRedWaxPolice (TheRedWaxPolice)
Aug 21 2018, 8:00 PM
Tags
  • BF Blender: 2.8
  • Grease Pencil
Subscribers
Antonio Vazquez (antoniov)
Brecht Van Lommel (brecht)
Daniel Martinez Lara (pepeland)
Matias Mendiola (mendio)
Pablo Vazquez (pablovazquez)
TheRedWaxPolice (TheRedWaxPolice)
William Reynish (billreynish)
Tokens
"Love" token, awarded by julperado."Love" token, awarded by xrg.

Description

The way it's implemented now (top to bottom) goes against all the standards regarding layers system, and it's extremely counter-intuitive, also makes things more difficult for people coming from other 2D packages.

Layers and modifiers are completely two different things, so I think consistency doesn't apply here.

Basically every software out there works like this:
Modifiers: Top to bottom
Layers: Bottom to top
I think it would be wise to follow those standards.

And let's not forget that layers systems are a very visual thing, so they need to look right. ?

Cheers.

Event Timeline

TheRedWaxPolice (TheRedWaxPolice) lowered the priority of this task from 90 to Normal.Aug 21 2018, 8:00 PM
TheRedWaxPolice (TheRedWaxPolice) created this task.
William Reynish (billreynish) added a subscriber: William Reynish (billreynish).Aug 21 2018, 10:03 PM

Yes, they probably should be inverted. However, it's not completely trivial to make this work, because Blender's UI list box always adds items in a list from top to bottom, so it would require some reworking of the UI code.

Not making excuses, just clarifying here.

Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) added subscribers: Matias Mendiola (mendio), Daniel Martinez Lara (pepeland), Pablo Vazquez (pablovazquez), Antonio Vazquez (antoniov).Aug 21 2018, 10:26 PM

Sure this requires code changes. The point here is if we want this or not. Really I haven't a strong opinion about this, so I would like listen artist opinions.

@Daniel Martinez Lara (pepeland) @Matias Mendiola (mendio) @venomgfx thoughts?

Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) added a comment.EditedAug 21 2018, 10:27 PM

About UI, add at the top of the list new layers is not a big issue, the main change is in drawing engine to do all drawings in inverse order.

And will this change affect annotations too?

William Reynish (billreynish) added a comment.Aug 21 2018, 10:30 PM

Surely the drawing can be in the same order, it's just the visual list that's flipped?

One of the main problems with inverting the list in a naive way, is that you'll want to list to build up from the bottom, so that if you only have one layer, it's rooted at the bottom of the UI list box. I don't know if that's easily possible, but if it is, then I think yes, it would be good to flip it.

Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) added a subscriber: Brecht Van Lommel (brecht).Aug 21 2018, 10:30 PM

Grease Pencil developers can keep this report open if they want to implement it, but note that in general this tracker is not intended for users to propose designs or features. For that there is:
https://devtalk.blender.org/c/user-feedback
https://blender.community/c/rightclickselect/

Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) added a comment.EditedAug 21 2018, 10:33 PM

@Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) I agree this is not the place to discuss this. I think we must close this task (or achive) and move the discussion to other forum.

I don't know what is the best for this devtalk or rightclickselect?

or maybe the 2D chat channel?

Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) added a comment.Aug 21 2018, 10:40 PM

If developers want to discuss design it's fine to do it here if you want, we do design tasks like that. But normally started by developers/designers on the module team, if someone else proposes a design you're free to close it.

Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) changed the task status from Unknown Status to Unknown Status.Aug 21 2018, 10:42 PM
Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) claimed this task.

ok, so we close this task because this is not the best place to discuss this topic. Anyway, I'm going to discuss internally with all members of GP team about this request.

TheRedWaxPolice (TheRedWaxPolice) added a comment.Aug 21 2018, 10:59 PM
In T56487#529285, @Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) wrote:

ok, so we close this task because this is not the best place to discuss this topic. Anyway, I'm going to discuss internally with all members of GP team about this request.

Thanks for considering..
And if you need a more broad opinion from artists, a topic on devtalk would do just fine, I guess. But I believe most 2d artists would want this standard behavior.

xrg (xrg) awarded a token.Aug 22 2018, 5:45 AM
Julian Perez (julperado) awarded a token.Aug 23 2018, 4:37 AM