| Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) | |
| Jul 16 2019, 6:48 PM |
| Ann Zhao (Ann40) |
| Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) |
| Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) |
| Campbell Barton (campbellbarton) |
| Clément Foucault (fclem) |
| Daniel Martinez Lara (pepeland) |
| Jeroen Bakker (jbakker) |
This is a requested feature for all 2D artists, texture painters and sculptors.
We need a way of rotating the full viewport as other softwares do, because sometimes is easier draw from left to right instead of drawing vertical, especially for lines.
There are some add-ons already for that, but these are partiall solutions and only works in some situations. We need a more general solution.
This is general problem for any mode that need to use a pen for drawing.
Shift numpad 4 and 6 don´t work with camera view, basically in camera view is where you want to have this feature, you can make some hacks/rig creating drivers with the camera rotation channels to controllers but you don´t want this, just a simple way to rotate the camera view. If Shift numpad 4 and 6 work in camera view will be enough.
About Shift + 4 or Shift + 6, if we solve the problem with camera view, still we have a big issue: Keymap
If you are drawing strokes with a pen, doing texture paint or sculpting, you need leave the pen, and use both hands to rotate.... this is not an option.
We need something like Key+Mouse to rotate viewport and Alt+Key to reset view to default orientation.
Reset orientation is critical for a good workflow also.
Also, it's important to define a key in the left side of the keyboard (the user can change it) because more people is right handed, so he keeps the right hand in the pen and press the rotate key with the left hand.
To give my 2 cents: I find it very easy to roll the view when using trackball navigation instead of turntable. The reason why I would love a more fleshed out feature is definitely for the camera view.
When in the camera view it's one way to just select the camera and start rotating it but there's no way of rolling the view like a canvas without rotating the camera itself.
The tilt navigation button is a nice additon but I don't use those navigation gizmo buttons as a regular user.
One way I could see it is a toggle next to "Lock camera to view"saying: "Lock view to camera"
It's a similar result but the difference would be that instead of going out of camera view when rotating it rolls the view.
This would make it behave more like a canvas in 2D applications.
Exiting the camera view could still be done by hitting numpad 0.
What do you think? @Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) @Matias Mendiola (mendio) @Daniel Martinez Lara (pepeland)
Agree @Antonio Vazquez (antoniov) Even so, add Shift + 4 or Shift + 6 functionality to camera view is not a bad decision.
Sure, this is just to keep consistency in Blender viewport navigation
I think I understand your idea @Julien Kaspar (JulienKaspar) , it's possible and of course there could be many other solutions for Roll/tilt.
IMO what we are looking for here, is something more at the core of the viewport navigation like Ctrl for zoom, Shift to pan, MMB to Orbit.
Find a good key+mouse combination to Roll/Tilt the viewport as Antonio saids, would be the best solution.
I think a solution could be storing the viewport navigation configuration per workspace and not globally. I was looking to implement this in the sculpt branch because it is nearly impossible to design a navigation model that fits brush related workflows and navigating large scenes. Maybe the tilt rotation could be the default rotation behavior in the grease pencil workspace, leaving the 3D rotation available through the gizmo or a less accessible shortcut
@Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) I think this task is more general than GPencil only and we would move as subtask to a more general task an not as subtask of T63757. I don't know what is the main task for that.
@Pablo Dobarro (pablodp606) What is sure is we must not do a solution for sculpt, a solution for Gpencil, etc... we need a solution for all.
@Antonio Vazquez (antoniov), this could be added to T63726: User Interface Module instead.
Different navigation controls per mode or per workspace would be problematic for muscle memory I think. I'd really only do that as a last resort, if we can't find a better solution.
Agree with the basic sentiment of @Brecht Van Lommel (brecht) and @Matias Mendiola (mendio). We should try and find a generic solution to this.
We could add a gizmo, as already suggested. Finding an unused keyboard + mouse combo is the harder part.
We could implement this feature regardless, and later find a combo that works, or let users set it up for now.
I think that options such as tilt rotation or constant zoom speed are not a user preference but a workflow design consideration. When people use different specialized programs for different workflow tasks, they have these navigation models build it, even if they share the fundamental concepts and shortcuts. Texturing programs that are designed to be used with a pen tablet usually have a slower rotation and constant zoom speeds, some of them even use trackball rotation by default, general-purpose 3D suites have faster rotation and variable zoom and panning to navigate scenes with a mouse and programs with a 2D view use tilt rotation. In my opinion, having a workspace designed for a task with an incorrect navigation model is worse than losing a bit of muscle memory when starting a new task.
I'm not sure how to solve this in the UI side, maybe we can add simple options in the workspace tab to control some viewport navigation options such as default tilt/orbit rotation, or use navigation configuration presets. I think that trying to fit architectural visualization, sculpting and 2D drawing, with both mouse and pen tablet support, into a single navigation model with global settings is not going to be the optimal solution for anyone.
But I agree, we can implement this feature first and then experiment with it for a while to see how it fits the navigation system in general.
I think that options such as tilt rotation or constant zoom speed are not a user preference but a workflow design consideration …
Exactly. I needed the rotation for my workflow, so I made a proof-of-concept add-on (and tested with over 30 happy students):
https://capnm.github.io/b8RollViewport/
But we shouldn't be forced to implement this via the Python API.
This guy explains also why Shift + Num X isn't a good option for artists: https://youtu.be/6Q-w5ZBWIEk?t=1993 :)
If it's all about being able to rotate the canvas in camera view mode, why not just adding a button beneath the camera window? Workflow: (Extra step for sculpting/texture painting: Lock "Camera to View",) touch that new button with the pen and drag to left or right to rotate the camera's local z axis ccw or cw, and drag down to reset. One-hand-solution. Maybe like a pie? Should work also for sculpting/tex.-painting, if you are willing to accept that you have to sculpt/stencil in camera view. You could set passepartout to 0% opaque.
